A Response to Brandon in the Spirit of an Open Dialogue
Comment from Brandon:
First off, props for posting my comment and not deleting it. I do regret the words I chose but I was infuriated when I first read this post in its entirety. For that, I apologize.
This is your truth, and I get it- but it comes across to me as written by somebody who doesn’t fully recognize the changes they made to the character, nor does it go in to how much Kermit evolved under Jim. About 2 years ago, I started a “rewatch” of all the Muppet videos/episodes/movies that I could find. Kermit was not yet peak Kermit in Hey, Cinderella!, Season 1 of The Muppet Show Kermit was not the same as he was by the end of the show’s run. Jim himself navigated criticism, commercialization, and inconsistency during Kermit’s evolution, sometimes pulling back, sometimes pushing forward. Then Kermit had another voice for Muppet Babies, while Jim was still around… but Jim’s Kermit was not making nearly as many appearances as he once did. Then Jim was taken from us. I was a devastated 5 year old (I still remember it).
A little while later, Kermit was back (thanks to you). But it wasn’t the same Kermit. I didn’t care though. But we can’t sit here and say that Kermit didn’t drastically change. His voice was different, his expressions were different, his tone changed, his freak outs were minimized. He stopped being another misfit surrounded by other misfits and became a quiet, meek, even keeled rational being. I know without a doubt that you put your heart and soul into Kermit during your years at the helm. But oftentimes Kermit came across as tired, and over it. I don’t say that to criticize. Your Kermit was the only way that I got new appearances of him and I enjoyed every moment. It’s only when I watched the entire catalog in a short period of time that the changes became so noticeable.
That is where I take issue with this post. Kermit has changed his entire life, there has never been an appearance where something wasn’t different from the last time. Whether it was down to who was puppeteering him, writing his scripts, giving him a body crafted from whatever the best fleece was at that moment in time. The current Kermit might not be the one you grew up with. He’s not the one I grew up with, and the one I grew up with isn’t the one my mom grew up with. But he still brings me SO MUCH joy when I see him in new appearances. He is still Kermit. Matt is my Kermit, You are my Kermit, Frank is my Kermit, Jim is my Kermit. Kermit lives. Tomorrow night, so many people will be able to enjoy what he has to bring once again. I hope that everyone can watch the special/pilot with an open heart and be full of hope again, like Jim always was, and accept people and creations as they are, as I believe he always did.
Kermit survives because he absorbs change without losing kindness. If he stops doing that, that is when he dies.
Hi Brandon,
I want to say that your comments impress me as having a great deal of critical thought behind them, as much as any I have read. I appreciate that you’re thinking on these issues.
You bring up “evolution” and suggest that I don’t go into it. Let me start by making clear that the evolution of Kermit is, in fact, the foundation of my entire post, as well as my overall approach to everything I feel about Jim’s influence within the characters and worlds he created with those of us he chose to work alongside him. It is the entire post that ‘goes into it’ in great depth. But, at the core of this is coming to terms with what evolution actually is and how it occurs.
“Evolution” isn’t mere change. When something ‘evolves’ it does so building upon how it began by moving through layers of development, one after the next. The best way I have heard it stated is that as a thing evolves it “transcends and includes” it’s previous developmental lines; ‘transcends’, or goes beyond what it was before, while “including” its original, foundational, components.
If something simply is suddenly ‘changed’ and ‘different’, that’s not evolution, especially if the changes are just expressions of a new set of someone’s preferences. Why? Because the core of the thing is lost and unknown, or has been removed, overlooked, or ignored, and is no longer its foundation. In other words, it is different, not evolved.
There is a consistent directionality to the evolutionary process no matter what it is that we are saying is ‘evolving’. Kermit did, indeed, evolve as Jim continued to add layers of development to him. He went from being an abstract “thing”, to being a specific thing, and that specific thing began to develop a personality that developed no differently than yours or mine has in our lifetimes. Those new elements that were included as an ongoing part of who Kermit became occurred mostly as a result of how he was used in new ways. That eventually led to his role as the leader at the center of the Muppet Show ensemble of characters. After that ensemble was established Kermit’s growth and evolution substantially plateaued, and he essentially remained at that particular level up until Jim’s death in 1990 with some continuing subtleties occurring to his overall organic movement.
When I became the character it was just after having spent a dozen years working alongside Jim in practically every situation in which he was performing Kermit. That period gave me the opportunity to fully experience from where Kermit arose within Jim right up and to his death, the parts of Jim that were also a part of Kermit, and the parts of Jim that we’re not. It was a significant time frame.
Through intense and rigorous research, pondering meditation, and confirmation of ideas from various sources, all of that went into the continuation of the character moving forward. It would have been categorically impossible for any of that to survive Jim’s death if I had not been fully immersed in it firsthand working alongside Jim. And that is the point.
While Kermit evolved steadily and naturally during Jim‘s lifetime (as one would expect), when he died, circumstances presented themselves that could have easily seen all of Jim‘s influence permanently disappear from the character for good. The process of Kermit’s evolution could have easily ceased with a recasting. But it didn’t because I had Jim as my guide. One day I want to get into more detail about my own process after Jim’s death, the steps I went through to keep Jim “alive” within Kermit. But for now, I’ll just say that (for good reason) not one factor in keeping Kermit faithful to what Jim created came from watching any video of any past performances. ALL of it came from my relationship with Jim, himself.
We know that over the years Kermit ‘evolved’ physically, too, but what I am focusing on here isn’t about adding an additional pointy collar for a few years, or straightening out his gnarled fingers. I am talking about the evolution of his soul and the complimentary additions to his manipulation style that accompanied it. Having said that, his physical differences, as well, stem from his evolving psyche as he became regarded more and more an organic being rather than a cloth doll.
The point is that as a persona, Kermit has not “changed” his entire life up until recently, he has grown. The differences in Kermit after Jim were not “drastic”. They were carefully tempered and measured subject to his origins. The biggest difference in the beginning was the quality of his voice, but not the inflection because all of that arises out of the timings of his core motivations. Those remained Jim’s.
Neither did his established manipulation style change. That’s because the man I intimately knew was playing in my head in every moment. And within a year or so Kermit was fully back according to the vast majority of standards. It was not until after then that he began to once again evolve, but that evolution was solely based on direct knowledge Jim’s original. I specifically chose not to part from that exemplar.
To your comments on Kermit’s’ expressions’, ‘freak outs’, being ‘quiet’, ‘meek’, ‘tired, and over it’, all of those types of things are about how Kermit was required to exist within stories and projects. I didn’t own Kermit like Jim did. I didn’t have the luxury of script or story approval. Ultimately, my performances were bound by whatever was put in front of me by executives and producers. If any of Kermit’s story-related attributes lessened, that was due to story content, not my decisions in performing him faithfully. Mine was a never-ending struggle to stay faithful to Jim while being forced to compromise in order to satisfy what was being required of me…why do you think I was cast out?
Also, this is not about my truth versus your truth versus anyone else’s ‘truth’. For an hypothesis to be determined to be factually accurate as “Truth”, it must go through a rigorous process of confirmation, and even falsification (as I touched upon in my original post). It’s a bit of a perversion of the meaning when we use the word “truth” in place of the word “opinion”. What I am offering you here is tested.
At the end of the day, Kermit is not just a character in movies. He is a real world personality as strong and valid, and with as much history, as Tom Cruise, or Robert Downey jr, or Timothée Chalamet. My post was written in order to offer an educated, but generally unavailable, perspective to the thousands of audience members who will benefit from knowing why what they are seeing isn’t recognizable as the frog they grew to love. The fact that the conversation has turned almost entirely to debating ‘versions’ substantiates, in and of itself, that there is no singular individual Kermit still in existence.
I sincerely appreciate the sentiment of your closing remark, Brandon. We should all work towards absorbing change without losing kindness. At the same time, Kermit’s kindness of which you speak is but one element of something much broader that has, indeed, determined life or death for him. It is Kermit’s truth – not just his kindness, but the whole of his Truth as Jim created and as I nurtured – that gave him life – consistent, evolving life – and that has already perished not to be retrieved because there is no longer subjective reference for the retrieval within the mix. What is now in his place is something completely dissociated from that, and for someone as close to him as I am, could never be recognized as Jim evolved.
Ladd Cann
The desperation to hold onto the reins of a character you held hostage for decades so YOU (not Kermit) could get your way is so beyond what Kermit represents to the majority who adore Kermit. Kermit’s soul was an extension of JIM, not YOU and it never will be no matter how much you argue with Kermit fans who disagree with you.
At least now I understand why Jim was adamant that Kermit be retired from being host of the show whenever he was to pass and requested Clifford take over hosting. Jim saw that while you had the voice, you lacked the soul of that hopeful tadpole.
Maybe read Before you Leap. You could use some advice on how to handle your emotions because Kermit is NOT dead, he’s just dead to YOU, which is sad considering how much you claim to best represent his soul.
Steve Whitmire
I control which comments get posted, so in fairness I am posting this one….fact check paragraph 2…
Amanda Walters
This is one thing I always admired about you Steve, the fact that you have always kept Kermit faithful to Jim’s influence. I have so much respect for you for that.
Each time I read your articles I learn more about Kermit and Jim’s legacy. I never got the chance to meet Jim unfortunately but I grow up watching the wonderful creations he left for us to enjoy.
You were Kermit growing up Steve and always will be just as Jim was always Kermit and always will be.
You were also many of my favorite characters including Wembley, Rizzo, Bean and Ernie! Thank you for originating such wonderful characters just as Jim did Kermit. One day I hope to hear your thoughts on these characters as well.
Watching you perform Kermit on tv, grow in spirit and evolve into the amazing person you are while also keeping true to Jim’s influence is something I’ll always respect you for. You a heck of a guy Steve!
To take on the heart and soul of the most famous frog in the world and stay true to his roots and keep Jim’s spirit alive makes me proud to be your fan.
Deep inside that’s something that will always be apart of you and something to be very proud of.
I really enjoy reading your posts and further educating myself as fan. You speak nothing but the truth and that’s what we all need is truth.
Please continue to speak up and enlighten people! Be the light the world needs! Looking forward to more!
Rachel
I understand the difference you point out between change and evolution. I just wrote a long comment on the other article, and I might have mis-used those terms in my reply, but I know what you mean and that evolution is not the same as change. In other words. The way Kermit changed when Jim was still alive or when you were doing him was different to the change that we see now. So if you read my other post, please bear in mind that I do understand the difference.
Mandy
Kermit wouldn’t be Kermit without you Steve! You breathed the breath of life into a green frog puppet and gave him not only a voice but a soul with destiny in life!
That frog in your throat was something more then just being Kermit’s new voice. It was Kermit himself.
You were chosen to be Kermit for a reason. Having know and working with Jim for many years has tought you alot about how Kermit is preformed from the inside and out.
You not only have the experience and knowledge it takes to be Kermit but you also have the essence of the character in you and that’s the true soul of Kermit.
It stems from the deep devotion that comes from the heart and blossoms into a magnificent character who is as alive as you and me.
Kermit is apart of you just as he was apart of Jim. The fact that you never changed anything about him say alot. You kept Kermit the same and that’s what kerp Kermit truly alive!
Everyday you make people just like me and so many others believe in the true magic that Kermit is a real being in this world and not just a pretend puppet! I think Jim would be very proud of you Steve!
You are the best friend a frog could ever have! Thank you for everything you continue do to keep Jim’s spite alive and keeping his most beloved character alive and going strong!
Evil Jay Leno
Kermit wouldn’t be Kermit without JIM, not Steve.
Steve Whitmire
I agree with you wholeheartedly! And, to follow your logic, Kermit is no longer Kermit without Jim’s influence.
Andrew Kay
I think i am going to say something sacrilegious here. It may sound blasphemous, foolish, and crazy (and i wouldn’t be surprised if it is all that), but it seems to make more and more sense to me the more i think about it.
Let me start from afar.
Once upon a time, early in 17th century somewhere around the city of Naples there might have been a very defined, very specific character named Pulecenella, with his unique special voice and his very own manner of speaking, his endearing personality quirks and habits, possibly a weakness for tasty parmigiana and his own unsurpassably salacious manner of singing Napolitano songs to Italian signoritas.
Unfortunately, the passage of time erased the traces of this original character and of the first performer who brought him into existence by exposing the facets of his own soul in a very unique, powerful and memorable manifestation of the character. All we know is that his performance must had really connected with the audience of the time and made him a major hit, as the character really took off and was in demand ever since.
Today we know him as Pulcinella in Italian Commedia dell’Arte, he is also called Polichinelle in France and Punch in Britain. He went thru multiple metamorphoses and countless performances of different type, content, and quality. He changed between masked human, marionette, and hand puppet. He shifted his physical attributes – potbelly, hunchback, prominent nose and bushy eyebrows varied wildly throughout his history. His social status ranged from a coarse bumpkin through cunning servant to a scheming noble. He survived. He lost most of the unique attributes of the original character performance and became both simplified and more versatile. He survived because of that. Losing big part of his initial individuality in the process, he became a universal archetype. He is very much alive today, even though even the memory of his creator is long gone. He achieved immortality.
I think something like that needs to happen to Muppets if they are to survive past the next 20-30 years. And I think this process has already started.
Jim is gone. You are gone. The original people who worked with Jim are becoming few, and unavailable to provide guidance, due to various reasons. Even the “lineage” process of passing the characters on by years of close work with the previous performer is not perfect, and sometimes unavailable. Not too far in the future, Bill’s “love, admire and be inspired” by the originals, the diligent study of old videos and other available data, may become the only way to go on. Unfortunate as it is, inheriting the characters is taking more of “behaviorism” approach (behavior defines personality) vs “depth psychology” one (personality defines behavior), even though that unavoidably leads to losing the fidelity and depth of the original. For example, even with performer as uncannily talented as Bill, i cannot imagine Rowlf having a personality TV show for himself anymore — and he used to run one! (I can easily visualize the “newborn” characters, coming from the performer himself, like Pepe or Uncle Deadly doing it, though. Kermit, with your help, was one miraculous exception to this rule!) The core Muppet characters are slowly losing both their psychological authenticity, the strength of character, and their active presence in this world, and becoming “tribute” roles to originals (however loving), imbued with modified personality and meaning. Woefully, we see it happening with Kermit now. This effect will become even more pronounced in 10, 20, 30 years, when David, Bill, Eric and Matt will have to pass their own and inherited characters down the line to a new generation of performers.
We know this is coming. However, quite counterintuitively, I think the only hope for survival for the Muppets lies with the very same “commodification” process that tears them apart — passing through the current “tribute” status, the “ersatz” Muppets are on the way to become “Muppets dell’Arte”, a comedy of masks and generalized roles: Kermit, the permanently unlucky manager henpecked by his co-star, Piggy the glamorous high-kick diva, Fozzie the hapless insecure comedian, Rowlf the somber piano-playng dog, Scooter the ever eager young assistant, Statler and Waldorf the interchangeable old grumps, etc. — these are the simplifications, depersonalized “masks”, roles open for a performer interpretation — same as Pulcinella, Harlequin and Columbine. They will no longer have the individuality and depth of the original characters created and performed by Jim, Frank, Richard and Jerry. In lieu of that, their accessibility and universality, their being not only “crayons” used for any picture but “blank crayons” ready to take on extra hues — paradoxically, this should become their strength instead, if they are to last.
IF they will survive the process.
By combining close personal knowledge of Jim with almost quantum level of personality research, and a great deal of pure magic of your talent, you managed to literally hold a piece of Jim’s soul in your hand and postpone this process by 25 years. In spite of everything fate and management had thrown your way, Kermit, the central spoke and tentpole of the Muppets, miraculously retained both his original soul and his life force, the strength of his presence and authenticity, which he supplied to the characters around him. Honestly, this is indeed a sheer miracle which we will be forever grateful to you for — somehow allowing us to enjoy the real, authentic Muppets for all this time.
Then J.P. Grosse decided he did not need Kermit anymore because Constantine was cheaper, and started the metamorphosis. For ten years some of us were holding our breath waiting for the the full implications of his decision to dawn on him, waiting for him to reconsider. No such luck. Poor Constantine really tries his very impressive best to be a close enough stand-in, but without having the full historical personality of real Kermit, that is only as far as he can go.
Muppets have two different ways to go now — either becoming a thing of the past, the unbeatable summit of the genre, the “Monty Python” of puppetry, revered by current and future fans — or living on and becoming the “Muppets dell’Arte”, a set of universal archetype roles able to survive multiple interpretations, recasts and even multicasts around the world.
The original creators and performers have done their job perfectly. They created the legend, the set of characters so universally loved that it lasted for 70 years now. It is truly tragic to watch this era drawing to an end, decades too early, due to managerial decision of someone who simply does not care.
Now it is time for the recasts old and new, for the new writers and the new creative teams to try to run with the treasure that was passed on to them, to apply their forces and see if it will fly.
These won’t be MY Muppets, the original Muppets i know and love as my friends, the Muppets i was able to enjoy — thanks to you! — for the 25 years past the passing of their creator. I will forever mourn losing them now.
But it might still become the new vehicle to pass the original Jim’s Muppets message of kindness, acceptance and hope to the next generations. If there is a chance it could do it, it deserves a chance to try.
IF the Muppets will survive this process. If the new Muppet guys will be up to the task. If they manage to play different tune of their own with the same humor (without being vulgar), warmth (without being saccharine) and sincerity (without being cynical) which made the original Muppets so dear to our hearts.
The process has started, and i don’t think anyone can stop it — even if there are fans on the web ready to tear down anyone who as much as hints at it. It is picking up speed as we speak. If we cannot return to originals (and J.P. Grosse seems ho have closed that door to us ten years ago), it may be the time for the old fans to step aside to give it way, meet the new incongruities with a sad understanding smile (as Frank usually does), and largely watch it go by from a distance, to see if it will fly or fry as it goes.
Steve Whitmire
Hi Andrew – what a well thought out idea.
You and I could go on down the rabbit hole of forever deconstructing a comparison of Pulecenella to Kermit (Heck, we might even enjoy it!), but I think the fact that it is broad and general makes your point, the conclusion of which for me is that for Kermit to attain a measure of immortality, so, too, must Jim. That has been, in a sense, the goal of everything I have done since his death. Otherwise Kermit is very likely to go down a path of fast becoming defined by a general set of traits and attributes that can be utilized in any number of portrayals by a like number of performers. Most unfortunate of all is that such a fate has already begun to also apply to Jim, himself.
It is, after all, the method used for Mickey. Is he “Steamboat Willie”, or a silent five foot tall mouse with a big plastic smile who moves too much…who knows? He is both and neither…he is no one at all, all of the above. And it’s what was being proposed in 2004 by the first round of Disney execs put in charge of the Muppets (‘we want to have a dozen performers all over the world so Kermit can be everywhere at the same time’), and is a big part of what prompted me to begin a deep study of what it was that Jim naturally did, why he did it, and why it was effective.
When dealing with those who run things, my point has always been that it is vital for the people behind the Muppets (the owners, producers, writers, and especially the performers) to think of each of them as ‘individuals’ that are just as alive as you and me. They can’t be treated as ‘puppet character’ knock-offs to be reinterpreted by any number of people because it is their individuality that constitutes their original and ongoing connection to the audience…if that connection is what is desired. I think it is not only desirable, but vital to their existence as who they are and the only acceptable way to respect Jim as the originator of it all. A new and different connection to a new and different version isn’t a connection to Kermit THE Frog, it’s a connection to Kermit A Frog.
Let’s presume that just as with Kermit, Pulecenella was, indeed, a specific and well-formed individual character created and performed exclusively by someone. But, since there was no way in the 1700’s to preserve a record of who he originally was, through having been performed and reinterpreted by any number of others there is no trace of his originator surviving. He becomes known by many other names in many other lands, subsequently emerging as differing versions based upon something no one actively remembers. Instead he has a list of standard characteristics none of which are enforced or expected by anyone.
That means there is no singular Pulecenella, just a world of knock-offs and versions There is no ‘lineage’, just broad ‘tradition’, at most, that points backward in time in a general direction. He’s becomes a ‘myth’ rather than a living individual, a hundred versions of a name from the past – that is what actually happened to him.
Can the ongoing notion of a former persona really be defined as ‘survival’?
I can understand this being viewed optimistically as a sort of “Christ story” where Jim’s message survives the details of the man, himself. But in that scenario under the corporate mandate to bring in revenue for the shareholders in first position, combined with overseeing the brand being little more than a wrung on the corporate ladder for executives, I think the sincerity of any message is as likely to be as muddied and forgotten as the individuality of the characters (not to mention exploited for all it’s worth…).
Unlike Pulecenella, the erasure of Kermit has not happened through the passage of time, it is being done out of ignorance with intentionality towards alternate directions. There is/was still considerable access to the very knowledge base and direct first-hand accounts of the man who originated Kermit, and in my case, from the only person who based the continuation of Jim’s most recognizable central creation upon a direct relationship with him.
Once the influence of the originator is gone, can any Neo-Kermit claim to be ‘Kermit’? Sure, absolutely. Anyone can claim anything – but the claim is bogus, illegitimate, based upon varying observations from a distance rather than anything of substantive depth.
Jim was no more immortal than who ever the person was who came up with Pulecenella. In your words, ‘Jim is gone…’. But in order to avoid the ambiguous fate of Pulecenella I saw a path leading to how it would have been entirely possible because of the advancements of modernity to establish a lasting definitive guide to be passed down through linear succession, to be utilized not as a restrictive dogmatic bible, but as a source of practical fact and wisdom for the next chosen singular carrier of the Kermit torch. That performer would add their own experiential epiphanies to the guide and would substantiate them with evidence, but the key word is “add” not recreate.
The fact that the Muppets are physically inorganic (i.e., they won’t die a physical death) offers an opportunity for them to continue as if the basis of their consciousness could be transferred forward beyond the corporal limitations faced by their performer and ‘installed’ in a successor chosen by the said previous performer.
For that to happen – for true evolution to continue to occur (and I believe it could have) – the transition would need to be linear, not randomly cast from a room full of auditionees and chosen by those making the same exterior objective judgments about the character as is the person auditioning. It’s not about a set of characteristics, it’s about the fundamentals of Kermit’s soul, and it has not been passed along to anyone.
But that opportunity is gone for all time. Keeping the fundamentals alive has no apparent value to executives within a post-modern corporate setting even as their companies broadly claim devotion to those values in order to exploit the notion with the fans. That’s not because it would be impossible to see those fundamentals passed on, it’s because the executives restrict their vision to their own survival within the hierarchy, mixed with general contempt towards any reliance upon an individual – everyone must have a back-up…trouble is, no one as an individual has a back-up for who they are, there interior selves.
And the absolute worst course of action is to drop a pin at some particular jumping off point half a century before, prior to the evolution of a character, and use that as a the moment in time to then go about trying to synthesize that soul. Not only is that what was done with Kermit, it is what was encouraged by those running the auditions. Jim simply never looked back, and I can assure you that he would have never chosen any earlier developmental stage of Kermit from ‘The Muppet Show 1970’s era’ as the basis for a project in 2026. That’s like saying ‘from now on forget everything back to the third grade, and start again from there.’
That is ‘regression’, the polar opposite of evolution. And it is the choice that is made by people who upon realizing that they have no idea how to continue the forward growth of something, choose in favor of reinventing it in their own image.
You are right , Andrew – ‘the original people who worked with Jim are becoming few…’. All the more reason why they should not be made ‘unavailable’ because of the hubris of executives who are doing nothing more than passing through the Muppet bubble in order to get a smile from people who see it on their future resumes, but that will undoubtedly continue to happen. What will survive, if anything, will be a shell, a puppet, a symbolic relic from the distant past for any and all to reimagine, created by some mythical man called Jim Henson whose truth and depth is disappearing as we speak…and the most ironic part is that to truly put Jim’s methodologies in first position is the one thing that can give the Muppets their very best shot at longevity, but first those methods have to be accurately interpreted. Second, executives have to be willing to truly collaborate.
BTW, I’m not saying any of this in opposition of any of your points. You are well spoken, well intentioned, and right. It’s too bad, but you’re right!…lol.
Being a purist often has some negative connotations, but if the original core of something is to remain intact to be built upon in a truly evolutionary way, a discipled integral purist is surely the curator of authenticity.
-S
Andrew Kay
Steve, you being a purist and the Jim’s methodologies you stood for allowed us all to enjoy the real, original Muppets for all this time (Thank the Lord for that!) — and would have allowed them to keep on, and pass the authenticity further. Alas, a decade of formal management and common indifference seems to have eroded that option… Alas!
With great respect and best wishes, always! — Andrew Kay